A message to all the people leaving "feedback."

[kiwimike]

I think the reader's point is that a comment saying 'X is rubbish' may not be helpful, but if you get a lot of that it's still an indication that something is going wrong. One person may be able to explain their reasons better than another, but all those others still lend weight to the general mood.

Yes, I agree with that. If you get one comment saying a particular feature is rubbish, then well, they still can't be wrong, because they are correct that they didn't like it! But then- you may find 20-50 others post straight after, saying the loved the feature. So then you get a overwhelming ratio with a very unscientific poll if you like-that the majority of the readers 'surveyed'...liked the feature. To me, that's feedback you can bank on!
If you get someone not liking a feature, and that's followed by a ton of other readers who didn't like it also...then that might be considered constructive as well, showing quite a few readers did not enjoy this particular feature.
I've never seen that though. In most cases you get one isolated reader who won't like something, and most posting after disagreeing, which is good feedback IMO showing the mag appealed to the majority of readers!

[Nemesis]

But surely- arguing those points IS feedback. It is input and response from the readers to the magazine. By definition it's feedback. It may or may not be helpful, but it's still feedback. And I would defend the right to do so personally.
If the same person is having the same bi*ch every issue, or is being ridiculous...it's still their opinion, they are still entitled to it, and it is still feedback surely?
For the most part, I agree with you. There are posts of the nature you mention that aren't constructive and can sometimes, at best, be over the top...and at worst, straight out dumb. But it's still an opinion from the readership- and if it is that weird an opinion you not only have the right of reply- you will find you will have a huge chunk of the readership rushing to your defence. And I've been in that too. And I will argue the point to the hilt- but never suggest the person in question has any right to raise it.

Agreed, feedback is feedback whether it is good or bad, useful or useless.

[CraigGrannell]

I think the reader's point is that a comment saying 'X is rubbish' may not be helpful, but if you get a lot of that it's still an indication that something is going wrong. One person may be able to explain their reasons better than another, but all those others still lend weight to the general mood.

With very few exceptions, that's not what happens, though. Almost all of these knee-jerk one-liner types of feedback relate to people's personal preferences. And even if everyone suddenly turned round and said all of an issue of RG was utter rot, that wouldn't be helpful. As you say, it would certainly "lend weight to the general mood", but it still wouldn't say why people aren't happy with the magazine.

[Matt_B]

With very few exceptions, that's not what happens, though. Almost all of these knee-jerk one-liner types of feedback relate to people's personal preferences. And even if everyone suddenly turned round and said all of an issue of RG was utter rot, that wouldn't be helpful. As you say, it would certainly "lend weight to the general mood", but it still wouldn't say why people aren't happy with the magazine.

More often than not it seems to be the opposite, i.e. one person makes a few gripes and the majority of the people here disagree with them and say they are more than happy with things the way they are.

[The Laird]

The only article I can ever remember recieving a number of negative reactions was the NES Collectors Guide and that was purely because the guy who wrote it made some factually incorrect statements that annoyed a number of people.

[kiwimike]

I think the reader's point is that a comment saying 'X is rubbish' may not be helpful, but if you get a lot of that it's still an indication that something is going wrong. One person may be able to explain their reasons better than another, but all those others still lend weight to the general mood.

With very few exceptions, that's not what happens, though. Almost all of these knee-jerk one-liner types of feedback relate to people's personal preferences. And even if everyone suddenly turned round and said all of an issue of RG was utter rot, that wouldn't be helpful. As you say, it would certainly "lend weight to the general mood", but it still wouldn't say why people aren't happy with the magazine.

But surely, if there was a case where a absolute ton of readers left feedback they hated a mag, that has to be useful in that you can look at the mag, what differs it from other issues, then decide what changes, if any, to make. IMO that's more useful than everyone saying they love it sychophantically it avoid hurting feelings, but not really, and never buying it again. Then they'd be this question why an issues income just suddenly crashed, when everyone who posted loved it.
But the good news is, it has never happened. You've for the most part had one isolated hate followed by others defending. That HAS to be useful, no? It shows you the ratio is that you are pleasing most of the people most of the time...which is all you can really hope for in reality.

[merman]

Let's get things straight and refer back to the original poster's point.

What Craig and I are saying is that the feedback which is just negative or contradictory to opinions expressed in the magazine is not helpful.

I am not saying that every piece of feedback has to be positive or indeed sycophantic. Miketendo's point was that he did not like rude or nasty feedback, and that the long stream of "that format/game/person is getting too much coverage" is not helpful.

By all means, express your opinions in the Feedback section. Before you hit Submit, just consider whether it is phrased in a way that will be constructive - because that will get you a better magazine in the long run.

[kiwimike]

Let's get things straight and refer back to the original poster's point.

What Craig and I are saying is that the feedback which is just negative or contradictory to opinions expressed in the magazine is not helpful.

I am not saying that every piece of feedback has to be positive or indeed sycophantic. Miketendo's point was that he did not like rude or nasty feedback, and that the long stream of "that format/game/person is getting too much coverage" is not helpful.

By all means, express your opinions in the Feedback section. Before you hit Submit, just consider whether it is phrased in a way that will be constructive - because that will get you a better magazine in the long run.

Hmm, yes and no....I know what you're saying, fur sure. I've seen a few feedback posts that do make you roll the eyes. But should someone say 'this article from this issue is sh*t' for example....it is a two way street, feedback. Hit straight back. Ask WHY it was. If you get no response, then you can dismiss it immediately and forget about. But IMO it is still helpful, you will get a response from other readers who will go along with that post, and more likely disagree.
There's three good example that come to mind for me...Feedback suggesting the 360 megadrive was rated too highly, the RG ereader app, and 'too much ZX.'
I think all three you might suggest aren't helpful...tbh I think you guys are being a little precious and over sensitive. All three of those topics ended up a pretty good discusssion, and whether you agree or disagree with the poster, you knew where they were coming from.
A lot of the time, your own opinion does not necessarily give the best and constructive feedback, but can be the responding posts from that.

[CraigGrannell]

Those topics are exceptions. Here's the more usual scenario for knee-jerk feedback:

The latest issue was RUBBISH!
Why?
*tumbleweed*

Or, if we're lucky:

The latest issue was RUBBISH!
Why?
Because it wasn't created specifically for me!

[kiwimike]

Yep, no response to the WHY they hate it-then response from other readers defending the issue. How is that not useful? It's a good poll!

Or, the I hate it because I don't like that machine or think it's covered too much...it's still a valid opinion. Is it useful? I guess you can say not. But what if you cover a machine that gets a flood of feedback-Such as the Simon feature? To me, it becomes useful once further comments are added to the topic. So the initial feedback may be biased or flat out dumb, but becomes useful due to other readers contributions.
But honestly-looking through the feedback, they aren't THAT many 'I Hated it' topics with no follow up reasons, generally there are added reasons. Whether they are valid or not are personal interpretation. Is that useful? IMO it is, and certainly creates a good discussion.
It is all opinion though.

[Miketendo]

Let's get things straight and refer back to the original poster's point.

What Craig and I are saying is that the feedback which is just negative or contradictory to opinions expressed in the magazine is not helpful.

I am not saying that every piece of feedback has to be positive or indeed sycophantic. Miketendo's point was that he did not like rude or nasty feedback, and that the long stream of "that format/game/person is getting too much coverage" is not helpful.

By all means, express your opinions in the Feedback section. Before you hit Submit, just consider whether it is phrased in a way that will be constructive - because that will get you a better magazine in the long run.

Thank you. This is the point I was bringing. Nobody says we don't have the right to do this. I'm just stating that it's not helpful to aid to the improvement of the magazine.